April 5, 2007 Remember to begin reading this transcript from the bottom to the top! FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:59:25 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Looks like it's going to be time to quit for the evening. It's been fun and you found so many things for Inga. I will go out now and grab the transcript so I can get it posted quickly. Thanks for all the help everyone - hope to see all of you again next week. Goodnight now. FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:59:16 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Gnight all! Let us all know what happens next! FROM: jerryt on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:58:35 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I don't find either the father or mother listed, though. Perhas it was spelled differently on the manifest. They are not listed on the same manifest as Signe is. FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:57:54 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kviteseid Kviteseid is a municipality in the county of Telemark, Norway. Its borders are in the northwest to Seljord, east to Nome, south to Drangedal, Nissedal and Fyresdal and west to Tokke. The highest point is Sveinsheia, 1,141 meters above sea level. The industries are forestry, agriculture, tourism and hydroelectric power. Within the municipality of Kviteseid one finds the little village of Morgedal, also known as "The Cradle of Modern Skiing" ("Skisportens vugge"), home of Sondre Norheim. Here, the olympic fire was lit for the Olympic Games in 1952 (Oslo), 1960 (Squaw Valley) and 1994 (Lillehammer). Kviteseid is also known for being a stop in the Telemark canal. There are several ski resorts in Kviteseid. Vrådal is one of them. [edit] The name The Norse form of the name was Hvítisei©£. The first element is the genitive case of *Hvítir 'the white one' (probably an older name of Kviteseidvatn), the last element is ei©£ n 'path between two lakes'. Until 1889 the name was written "Hviteseid". FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:56:46 GMT-DATE About the Ship United States: http://www.norwayheritage.com/p_ship.asp?sh=unist FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:55:54 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Searching Kvitteseid: I am just getting started in this area, although others in my family line have done quite a bit of research. I don't know yet which lines need the work, but will update that shortly. I believe that one is a Nancy Graham whose family lived in Ohio and in North or South Carolina. Another line on my mother's side is a Mette Skogrand from Kvitteseid, Norway. My parents are Lois Holt and Dwaine Nelson. I now live in an Atlanta suburb with my wife, Jane and 8 children. I am active LDS. My favorite sister is Lori. The Bruce D. Nelson Family Home Page Updated September 5, 2000 * Bruce David Nelson 1025 Churchill Lane Roswell, GA 30075 United States 770-518-5659 nelsonb@ibm.net http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/n/e/l/Bruce-D-Nelson/index.html FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:55:40 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: The ship sailed from Kristiania on May 18, 1906 FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:53:14 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: The Ship was Called the United States: Here's her info from DigitalArikivit 1906 219 12 1 16.05.1906 18.05.1906 Signe Jordgraff ug tj. k 16 Kvitteseid Minnesota 40 Lie United States Prp til sine forældre FROM: jerryt on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:52:58 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Inga -p you can go to the Ellis Island site and search for her.. There appears to be a picture of the ship. It is free to register. Ellis Island Site: http://www.ellisisland.org/search/passSearch.asp FROM: Inga on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:51:09 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Jerryt THanks for your information on my mother Signe. Can you tell me how to get a picture of the ship? Time to go it's almost 9 FROM: jerryt on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:50:11 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Judy - that is from the Ellis Island site. Yes, the ship was the United States. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:50:00 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Jerry, can you find Marie Aaboe Jordgraff? FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:49:17 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Inga - I will have the transcript posted about 9:15 this evening. It will be a text file and you can download it and then copy whatever you want from it. It will probably be 30 or 40 pages long so you won't want the whole thing! You can see the page where the transcripts are posted by clicking below. Transcript: http://www.rootsweb.com/~waccgs/p3424.htm FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:49:00 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Jerry, where did that come from? Was the ship called the United States? FROM: Inga on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:48:48 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Nancy What a great discription of the road to Kvitisied. FROM: jerryt on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:47:16 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: First Name: Signe L. Last Name: Jordgraff Ethnicity: Norway, Scand. Last Place of Residence: Telemarken Date of Arrival: May 29, 1906 Age at Arrival: 16y Gender: F Marital Status: S Ship of Travel: United States Port of Departure: Christiania Manifest Line Number: 0029 FROM: Inga on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:47:02 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Riley, Yes yees my mother Signa was born in Kvitisied. this has been most interesting reading all this wonderful information FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:46:42 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Looking again at the Telemark map: Kilen: Kilen ligger 30 km fra Kviteseid, 25 km fra Seljord, 25 km fra Lunde, 35 km fra Bø og 65 km fra Skien. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:45:32 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: KL my sil has the Short name in his ancestry....Thomas Short, 1848, Lincolnshire, England FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:45:11 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: That was on the bike route: http://www.bike-norway.com/Rute.asp?ID=2&KID=35&lang=ENG FROM: KL Hobby on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:44:07 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Yes Pat I will do that FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:43:48 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Attractions: Kviteseid: Kviteseid Bygdetun, a collection of 12 old houses and of rural environments and a sculpture house. Kviteseid Old Church, a stone church from the 12th C stands next to the houses. For further information T: +47 35 05 63 70, F: +47 35 05 63 75, vts@telnett.no FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:43:42 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I think Ken's new family connection would be a great subject for next week since we're kind of short on time this evening. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:43:07 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Wow, wonder if Kviteseid is the village/town Signe was born in? FROM: KL Hobby on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:42:28 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Nancy, a person that had the Short family connection e mailed me and when I told her my story she was able to trace my Grandfather Charles Short back to Tennessee to a William H, Short. My DNA says that I am descended from Burrell Short son of Landman Short of North Carolina 1737 FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:42:04 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Inge, Bicyle route through KILEN... From Dalen the route follows quiet roads south through a dramatic, vibrant landscape. Vrådal is well worth a stopover and from here the road to Kviteseid starts with a long, steep climb before the downward stretch through breathtaking hairpin bends. Turn off at Kviteseid village and take the road down to Fjågesund and then on along Flåvatn where you once more meet the canal, and follow it to Lunde and Ulefoss. We recommend you stay the night or at least stop for a while at Kilen Feriesenter. There's a beautiful sandy beach here and lots of activities for you to enjoy. A stop at the locks at Lunde and the cosy lock-café where you can watch how the locks work is a "must". The stretch of road from Vrangfoss to Ulefoss is quiet with little traffic and leads to Ulefos Manor. The route can be cycled in both directions. FROM: jerryt on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:41:38 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I woud think either the Ellis Island site or perhaps Castle Garden. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:41:38 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Joy, how about Kritisied? FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:40:45 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Inga, I found some ENGLISH! for The Telemark canal Route Description and map at http://www.bike-norway.com/Rute.asp?ID=2&KID=34&lang=ENG< FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:40:28 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Telemark is a province / county, I was hoping for a village FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:39:12 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Jerry, Inga wondered about finding the ship her mom came to US on in 1906...any ideas where to search? FROM: jerryt on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:38:23 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: That woud be fun Judy, but I don't hink they would survive for long!! It would be better to take some of the warm ocean water back to enjoy. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:38:09 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Joy, think Inga said Telemarken, Norway was hometown of mother FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:38:00 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Another early name on the JORDGRAV farm photo: ... Andres Kjetilson Jordgrav, (1814-1872). FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:36:08 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Jerry, maybe you could take a couple of those palm trees home and make you think it was warm in CO FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:35:08 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Inge, I clicked on the menu item KILEN and a map came up: at http://www.kilen.as/index.html I'm not scared of the language, just have to look around for similarities! FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:33:57 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Pat, Got you message before I shut down for the night glad you could make it into the chat room Inga! FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:33:07 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Ken, What's the latest discovery? FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:32:22 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: This photo is labelled: Gårdsbruk Jordgrav: http://www.kilen.as/kilen_hovedside/gaardsbruk/jordgrav.html FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:28:46 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Example on webpage: 145. Olav f. 1855 d. Jordgrav 1945 ~ 1875 Anne Kristensdotter (Rui 127) f. 1844 d. Jordgrav 1911. FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:28:03 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Google.com found a bunch of JORDGRAV at http://www.jfredpeterson.com/kvites/kvsog228.htm FROM: jerryt on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:27:21 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Heading back that way tomorrow afternoon Pat. FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:26:59 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Inga, do you know where Signe was born? Also did her sister come to the US? FROM: jerryt on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:26:54 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Greetings from a rainy and warm Florida!! FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:26:50 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hello Jerry - are you home yet? FROM: KL Hobby on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:25:58 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hi everyone. Just dropped in to read all the inputs. I find it all very interesting and informative. Working away trying to trace my new found family (Short) from St Louis back to Tennessee and Kentucky FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:24:50 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Is that Ken? Glad to see you! FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:22:10 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hello KL Hobby - What can we do to help you this evening? FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:21:05 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: That paper says farm name: JORDGRAV FROM: Inga on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:20:41 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Joy, He was in the Telemarken, Kvitisied area.Born 1844 died 1890.Jordgraff I mean. I'll try to get more imfo to give you ladies and gentlemen to work on Inga FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:20:18 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Telelaget of America? at http://www.telelaget.com/Telemark%20HTML/ComingHomeKjetilOlavsonJordgrav.htm FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:18:57 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Google.com has http://www.vroueskole.fjends.dk/sjoerup/sjo-bill/target44.html A photo of cemetery? Sjørup-web -- jordgrav.jpg FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:17:27 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Always looking for clues... maybe more came later.... FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:16:54 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Nancy, her family came in the early 1900s FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:16:19 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Norwegians in the Civil War Vesterheim > Civil War DB > J > JOR > JORDGRAV, Michal Browse by last name A B C D E F G H I J K L M N O P Q R S T U V W X Y Z JORDGRAV, Michal From Telemarken, Norway. Civil War: Private. Post war: Lived at Porter, Minnesota. Sources: (Ulvestad p299) http://vesterheim.org/CivilWar/db/j/jor/005084.html FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:13:50 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Inga, it could be either. I'm more familiar with Sweden than Norway, but if we could pin down a location in Norway, we might be able to find his occupation. I had a Swedish relative who was a sailor and lost at sea FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:13:08 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: In LDS: Kittel JORDGRAV Self M Male W 76 NOR Farm Laborer NOR NOR Margit JORDGRAV Wife M Female W 80 NOR Keeping House NOR NOR Source Information: Census Place Eglon, Clay, Minnesota Family History Library Film 1254617 NA Film Number T9-0617 Page Number 531D FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:11:40 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Oops, thanks, you found that one! FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:11:16 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Judy asked, Joy, wonder if there was another way to spell that Jordgraff name? Must but that on the list to ask Inga too@ FROM: Inga on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:10:58 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Riley. The only other spellinng of Jordgraff is Jordgrav. He's my grandfather and have questions of his death.It said "lost at sea" Was he Merchant Marine or just looking for dinner? FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:07:05 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I sent a quick note to Judy - hope she looks at her e-mail tonight! FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:06:38 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hi Inga FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:04:48 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hello Inga - Joy is still here. She's one who found a lot of information for you. The other lady, Suzanne, didn't join us this evening. FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:04:38 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Oops. Judy Riley logged out. Maybe she'll be back. FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 3:03:55 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hi Inga, Glad to see you this evening! FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:58:33 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I always save the files as text but for some dumb reason I had saved the one preliminary posting as a WordPerfect format. I can open most anything with WP = even Word if necessary. I use it for most things - have never mastered Word and I only use it when absolutely necessary. FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:55:56 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Pat, I do have most trouble with WP documents. Most everything else will work with my iMac. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:54:10 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I had a problem posting the transcript last week. It just wouldn't show up - so I finally left it until morning. That's when I finally figured out I had posted it originally as a WordPerfect file - not text. As soon as I changed the original posting to text, it worked fine. I knew most folks wouldn't be able to open it as a WP document! FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:38:12 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: You can see information about the group which gives the award by clicking below. The web site for the Charles Brown House in Vancouver also won it this year. Genealogy awards site: http://awards.mnwebsteps.com/ FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:36:46 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: It's been a real learning experience and I have been enjoying it. There are so many folks who are working on it which makes it that much more rewarding. FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:36:14 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Pat, That's great! I like the boat! FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:35:50 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Joy, wonder if there was another way to spell that Jordgraff name? Must but that on the list to ask Inga too@ FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:35:06 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Cool FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:34:55 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Cool, Pat. Lots of work went/going into all that cemetery work. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:34:00 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I hope this will post. CCGS received an award for our Clark County Cemeteries web project. This is the icon that is on that site now. http://rootsweb.com/~waclacem/award.jpg FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:30:13 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Judy, there are no hits for Jordgraff or Jordgraf on Ancestry.com There is only two for Jordgrav and that is a couple in 1880. FROM: Steve on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:27:00 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: 1880 Census: SPENCER NEWTON 13 W IA IA VAN BUREN VERNON (Series: T9 Roll: 367 Page: 500) FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:26:19 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: The Archives are hard to use, but this page is very helpful with how to use it How to Use Norway's Digital Archives: http://www.rootsweb.com/~norway/DigitalArchives.html FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:25:55 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Thanks Steve...another family member found! FROM: Steve on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:24:52 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: 1920 Census: SPENCER NEWTON 52 M W IA IA VAN BUREN KEOSAUQUA; VAN BUREN (Series: T625 Roll: 516 Page: 36) FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:24:51 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Joy can you find anything about Signes mother Marie Aaboe Jordgraff coming to US? FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:24:39 GMT-DATE Norway's Digital Archives: http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/WebMeta.exe?spraak=e FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:22:47 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Joy, I don't...if Inga doesn't make it into the chat room, will ask her FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:22:35 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I remember when they put in those Garden Pots. Such a neat idea. My mother-in-law was living there when they installed them. She thought they were great and she enjoyed using one. FROM: Steve on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:22:22 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: 1910 Census: SPENCER NEWTON I 42 M W IA IA VAN BUREN VAN BUREN TWP (Series: T624 Roll: 425 Page: 162) FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:21:18 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I'll bet there are a lot of surprises out there. Especially with some people from long ago who thought no one would ever know about an affair they had - one that resulted in the birth of a child that doesn't match anyone else in the family. FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:21:01 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Judy, do you know if Signe's sister came to America? FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:20:45 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Okay Nancy....I had to think about your Garden Pot! Others may not know that they are waist high giant pots that the residents use a gardening "plots" FROM: Steve on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:20:28 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: 1900 Census: SPENCER NEWTON 33 M W IA IA VAN BUREN VAN BUREN TWP (Series: T623 Roll: 462 Page: 141) FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:19:42 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Pat, Since Rootsweb lists told us we could write more about our DNA projects, I've been posting more to our ELDER list. Then I get more queries! So many researchers have mixed up the PAXTANG PA families with others, that our DNA project is shocking them! FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:19:08 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Here's a fellow who was a native of County Latrim, Ireland. Lots of the stones mention where in Ireland that person was born. http://www.rootsweb.com/~waclacem/StJamesAcres/moranjn.jpg FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:17:57 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Judy, YES! Went on several walks and helped again with another resident's Garden Pot. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:17:39 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: The time goes so fast for me when I'm on the computer. That's why I set a timer so I don't forget. It's so easy to do. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:17:03 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hi Nancy - We were missing you. Are you busy again with your DNA project? FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:16:50 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Yipes! Sorry, I did it again! Was looking for files to answer a DNA query....got lost. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:16:47 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Evening Nancy...did you enjoy the sunshine today? FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:15:13 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I have a couple relatives in St. James...a neat cemetery to walk through and look at stones. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:14:16 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Good evening Joy - you found some great items for Inga. Thanks so much for posting them. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:13:58 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: any body want to search for Newton W Spencer, DOB 1867 IA FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:13:21 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Here's an interesting stone - and really old - from the St. James Cemetery. She's Maria Agnus Wright and she died in 1859. http://www.rootsweb.com/~waclacem/StJamesAcres/wrightma.jpg FROM: Steve on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:08:46 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Almost forgot ... if you're into New England research, the Fiske Library is suppose to be good as well. There is a list of links at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~waseags/links.html FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:08:30 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Glad to help, Judy. If Inga runs across anymore details about Norway, I tried really hard to find Signe with her family in Norway, but I couldn't find her in 1900 on Norway's census. Maybe she has some more clues. FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:07:06 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hi Everyone FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:07:02 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Evening Joy...thanks for the explanation about Signe Svensen. Inga thought that might be the reason for the name Svensen FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:05:28 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Steve, that is good to know. I certainly could spend a lot of time there....Now the UW library could be hard to swallow for the Coug alumni FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:05:18 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: CCGS is a pretty good organization - too bad more people around this area don't know about us! I've been working quite a bit on the Clark County Cemeteries this past week. I posted some photos on the Mt. Zion site (LaCenter) and also on the St. James Acres Catholic Cemetery (Vancouver). I was amazed at the age of some of the stones in St. James. And so many people born in Ireland. Lots of info on their stones. FROM: Steve on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:04:02 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Judy, I was a member of the Seattle Genealogy Society before moving down here. Their library is probably 3x the size of CCGS and is right across the street from the National Archives. The Seattle Public Libary has a great genealogy section. There are also some good resources at the UW Library. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 2:02:00 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: I look into a lot of genealogy websites and have to say the CCGS has one of the better ones and lots of information. Amazing how many genealogy societies don't have much "free" info but say they will do look ups for a fee...guess that is their only income source. FROM: Steve on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:59:04 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: No Pat, but I did have trouble driving due to the brightness. Got down to CCGS and removed the disk drive and memory from the old black IBM computer in the back of the annex. I've applied for a grant with FreeGeek in Portland to get upgraded parts. I want to establish our new CCGS Surname List on it. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:58:24 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Well, where we go I will keep working on genealogy...at least can join in the chat room and visit with all of you FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:57:39 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Yes, we're really quiet this evening. Several things have been posted for Inga and hopefully there is a lot of new info for her. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:56:57 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: We'll be sorry to lose you in Vancouver Judy. I can understand why you'd like to be closer to the daughters though. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:55:58 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Evening Steve. Did you get a sun tan today? FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:55:37 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Not sure, Pat. Taking it one week at a time. Have our house up for sale with the possiblity of moving to Seattle area to be nearer daughters. FROM: Steve on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:55:12 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Wow, sure is quiet again this evening. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:54:06 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Judy - are you going to come to the seminar next month? It should be a good one and the raffle is going to be really good! I'm working on getting all the prizes ready now and I think many of them will collect a lot of tickets. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:49:15 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: That's probably the same way Jeanine Bailiff's grandpa changed his name. Seems he went from something like Patterson to Strand which seemed like a strange change of names. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:47:30 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Inga was very please with the info that has already been posted. Joy explanation of the name that Signe had when she came to US greatly helped explain the "Svensen" name. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:46:00 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: It certainly is a lot more comfortable in the mornings when we walk. Those few days recently with frost were mighty chilly. We're usually out before 7:00 for our 2 1/2 mile walk around our complex. FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:43:50 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Suppose to be better tomorrow...may have to break out the sun screen FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:43:05 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hi Judy - it was so nice today. This kind of weather could spoil me fast! I hope it will keep on for a few days. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:42:20 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Hi everyone - I'm glad to see how much information has been posted. And I see Inga joined us, too! FROM: Riley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:42:18 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Evening Pat...enjoy the sunshine? FROM: Inga on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 21:59:23 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Really appreciate all the work you people are doing for me FROM: Nancy Elder Petersen on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 4:55:54 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Thanks for the info everyone! Always happy to see more success stories. FROM: JudyRiley on DATE-Apr 5, 2007 1:58:23 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Looking at the information that has been listed for Inga...she will be thrilled. She had some of the facts but not sure how far back in Norway she had family. Many thanks to all of you. FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 4, 2007 19:23:54 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Do not look for a marriage to a Swenson. When she immigrated she used the patrynomic name Svensdatter or Svensson because her father's name was Sven or a version of Sven. It was likely that he was a son of Enders (thus Endresson) and took the name Jordgraff or Jordgrav for his occupation or place he lived. FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 4, 2007 19:17:51 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Note that the spelling of her birthplace is really massacred. 3. HAAKON JOHANSEN/5 JOHNSON (ALEXANDER4 JOHANSEN, ..3, ..2, ..1) was born July 24, 1883 in Bobin, Nordland, Norway, and died November 17, 1958 in Fortuna, Divide, North Dakota. He married SIGNE MARIE AABOE/ SWENSON/YORGRAFF October 26, 1917 in Fortuna, Divide, North Dakota, daughter of JORDGRAFF YORGRAFF and MARY AABOE. She was born March 17, 1890 in Zlbryrdrof, Trllemarkem, Norway, and died October 18, 1945 in Fortuna, Divide, Nd. 9. ii. HAZEL BERTINA JOHNSON, b. October 1, 1919, Fortuna, Divide, ND; d. July 13, 1991, Crosby, Divide, ND. 10. iii. boy living 11. iv. girl living 12. v. boy living Contact person: longtermlo@aol.com Website: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~longtermlo/p30.htm FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 4, 2007 19:15:41 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: WWI Draft Registration Haakon Alfred Johnson RFD, Fortuna, Divide County, ND Age: 35, born July 24, 1883 White, naturalized Farming, self employed, Lincoln Vally Nearest relative: Signa Johnson, RFD, Fortuna, Divide, ND Medium height, Medium build, blue eyes, Dark brown hair Sept 12, 1918 FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 4, 2007 19:15:28 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Passenger and Immigration Lists Index, 1500s-1900s about Signe Swenson Name: Signe Swenson Year: 1912 Place: North Dakota Source Publication Code: 9812.8 Primary Immigrant: Swenson, Signe Source Bibliography: WILLISTON GENEALOGY CLUB. I Hereby Declare: An Index to the Declaration of Intention and Final Naturalization Papers, Williams County, North Dakota, 1892-1955. Williston, N. Dak.: Williston Community Centennial Commission, 1986. 201p. Page: 117 FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 4, 2007 19:15:12 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Source Citation: Year: 1930; Census Place: Lincoln Valley, Divide, North Dakota; Roll: 1734; Page: 2B; Enumeration District: 24; Image: 510.0. Johnson, Haakon, head, m, w, 46, m, 24, Norway, Norway, Norway, 1902, Naturalized, farmer, mixed farm Signe, wife, f, w, 39, m, 27, Norway, Norway, Norway, 1905, Naturalized Hazel B, daughter, f, w, 11, s, North Dakota, Norway, Norway Alfred A, son, m, w, 8, s, North Dakota, Norway, Norway Irene M, daughter, f, w, 6, s, North Dakota, Norway, Norway Earl H, son, m, w, 5, s, North Dakota, Norway, Norway FROM: Joy on DATE-Apr 4, 2007 19:15:02 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Source Citation: Year: 1920;Census Place: Lincoln Valley, Divide, North Dakota; Roll: T625_1331; Page: 14B; Enumeration District: 43; Image: 1034. 13 March 1920 208/208, Johnson, Hakon, head, m, w, 36, m, 1902, Naturalized 1912, Norway, Norway, Norway, Farmer, grain stock Signe, wife, f, w, 28, m, 1906, Naturalized 1912, Norway, Norway, Norway Hazel, daughter, f, w, 2/12, s, North Dakota, Norway, Norway Johnson, Sigurd, brother, m, w, 32, s, 1905, Naturalized 1915, Norway, Norway, Norway, farmer FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 4, 2007 16:31:35 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Part II: draft card lists nearest relative as signa johnson Passenger and Immigration Lists Index, 1500s-1900s about Haakon Johnson Name: Haakon Johnson Year: 1907 Place: North Dakota Source Publication Code: 9812.8 Primary Immigrant: Johnson, Haakon Source Bibliography: WILLISTON GENEALOGY CLUB. I Hereby Declare: An Index to the Declaration of Intention and Final Naturalization Papers, Williams County, North Dakota, 1892-1955. Williston, N. Dak.: Williston Community Centennial Commission, 1986. 201p. Page: 56 Gale Research. Passenger and Immigration Lists Index, 1500s-1900s [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: The Generations Network, Inc., 2006. Original data: Filby, P. William, ed.. Passenger and Immigration Lists Index, 1500s-1900s. Farmington Hills, MI, USA: Gale Research, 2006. problem with the parent information. if signe's maiden name was aaboe, then why is her mother's jordgraff? or jordraff? or jordfraff? three misspellings? poor transitions on name changes in the post. i'd recommend that the person look at the social security application of these people. anyone who passed away after 1/1/1937 has an application on file. write a letter like this for access: Social Security Administration Office of Earnings Operations FOIA Workgroup 300 N. Greene Street P.O. Box 33022 Baltimore, Maryland 21290 Re: Freedom of Information Act Request Dear Freedom of Information Officer, I am writing this request under the Freedom of Information Act, 5 U.S.C. Section 552. I hereby request a copy of the SS-5, Application for Social Security Card, or a corresponding NUMIDENT printout (see below) for the following individual: (name at the time of death) (social security # if known) Birth: Death: This individual is deceased, having been listed in the Social Security Administration's Death Master File. I understand the fee for this service is $27 for copy of original SS-5 application OR $16 for copy of an abbreviated NUMIDENT printout when the Social Security Number is provided. I am requesting a (circle one: SS-5 copy OR Numident printout) Included is a check for $______ made out to the Social Security Administration to cover any administrative costs required by this request. Please respond to my request upon receipt of this initial correspondence. Thank you for your attention and assistance. Sincerely, Address: Daytime Phone Number: i always strongly recommend that you look for one generation at a time, the generation nearest the person in time. the key with genealogy is: start with what you know, gather documentation, then go backwards in time. records for the children often give information about the parents. it would be best to get the death record, social security application (if information is unknown), the marriage record(s) and then try to get a birth record. in this case, the immigration record would be helpful. get your census records. 1930 is the last public census record but you can contact the bureau of census and ask for census records of your relative for 1940 up to the present. you would need your parents' death certificate and your birth certificate to prove that you are a relative. census records are not made public until 72 years after the date of the census. it also occurs to me that often we forget to gather documentation about ourselves and our parents and this is the very first place to start. helpful records: land, probate, vital records, immigration records, military records, court records, marriage/divorce records, newspaper mentions. if you trace your family's migration path, you will know which county/state to write for records. FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 4, 2007 16:31:17 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: This info is from Suzanne Hamlet Shatto. The program wouldn't let her in so I said I would post it for her. It will be in two parts. Year: 1920;Census Place: Lincoln Valley, Divide, North Dakota; Roll: T625_1331; Page: 14B; Enumeration District: 43; Image: 1034. Name: Signe Johnson Home in 1920: Lincoln Valley, Divide, North Dakota Age: 28 years Estimated birth year: abt 1892 Birthplace: Norway Relation to Head of House: Wife Spouse's name: Hakan Father's Birth Place: Norway Mother's Birth Place: Norway Marital Status: Married Race: White Sex: Female Year of Immigration: 1906 Able to read: Yes Able to Write: Yes Image: 1034 Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Hakan Johnson 36 Signe Johnson 28 Hazel Johnson 2/12 Sigurd Johnson 32 Name: Haakon Johnson Home in 1930: Lincoln Valley, Divide, North Dakota Age: 46 Estimated birth year: abt 1884 Birthplace: Norway Relation to Head of House: Head Spouse's name: Signe Race: White Occupation: Education: Military Service: Rent/home value: Age at first marriage: Parents' birthplace: View image Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Haakon Johnson 46 Signe Johnson 39 Hazel B Johnson 11 Alfred A Johnson 8 Inga M Johnson 6 Earl H Johnson 5 Year: 1930; Census Place: Lincoln Valley, Divide, North Dakota; Roll: 1734; Page: 2B; Enumeration District: 24; Image: 510.0. World War I Draft Registration Cards, 1917-1918 about Haakon Alfred Johnson Name: Haakon Alfred Johnson City: Not Stated County: Divide State: North Dakota Birth Date: 24 Jul 1883 Race: White Roll: 1819408 DraftBoard: 0 FROM: PatB on DATE-Apr 3, 2007 20:19:32 GMT-DATE MESSAGE: Just checking to make sure this posted o.k. Looks good to me! See you Thursday evening. FROM: Nancy & Pat on DATE-Apr 3, 2007 20:18:31 GMT-DATE EMAIL: patbauer@pacifier.com MESSAGE: Nancy Elder Petersen and Patricia McKee Bauer, along with several regular visitors, will be staffing the GenChat room beginning about 6:45 p.m. Thursday evening. We close the door about 9:00 p.m. Pacific Daylight Time. We have lots of visitors who will give you a willing helping hand with your genealogy brick walls. You can enter questions or answers at any time but we hope you will be able to join us when we are open for discussions. THIS WILL BE A TOPIC FOR THIS WEEK: This is a query we received from Judy Riley about her neighbor. My neighbor Inga Petersen asked if we could help her with info on her mother and grandparents. Her mother was Signe Aaboe DOB March 17, 1890 in Telemarken Norway. Immigrated to US May 18, 1906 to Watson, MN DOD Oct 18, 1945 in Crosby, ND. Married Haakon Johnson Oct 26, 1917 in Crosby, Divide, ND. Applying for citizenship she was known as Signe Swenson. No record of when she married Swenson. Inga's grandmother was Marie Aaboe Jordgraff. DOB 1865 in Norway. DOD Jan 3, 1944 in Minnesota. Married Jordfraff 1887 Inga's grandfather was Svienung Jordraff (aka Sven Graves, aka Svienung Endresson. DOB 1847, DOD 1890...family history says lost at sea while fishing...was he a commercial fisherman? Marie and Svienung had 2 daughters, Anne Marie DOB 1888 and Signe DOB 1890 Please feel free to come into GenChat anytime and post a query. The visitors love to have a challenge and welcome your "brickwall" problems. If you don't send us something, you'll continue working on our little problems! Please click on the "log-out" button (lower right) before you leave. Meanwhile, you can see our past transcripts by clicking below and following the links to the postings. Past transcripts: http://www.rootsweb.com/~waccgs/p3424.htm